bridge with bead spacers

[ChinnyMom]

hey all,

on another forum, a member is convinced that their bridge with wooden bead spacers is not a hazard in their chins' cage. i'm trying to get them to see that the spaces between the slats pose a problem and the chins could potentially get their foot or leg stuck in there.

i know this may sound incredibly morbid, but does anyone have a photo of a chin stuck and/or hanging from one of these types of bridges that i might copy and paste to this other forum to show this member that it can happen?

thanks!

 

[Peep_erz]

I don't have pictures and the story isn't about the bridge specifically. There was a member here who found their chin dangling from its foot between the shelf and the cage. the shelf wasn't very flush and there was a gap.

there are also multiple stories of chins getting their feet caught on the wire ramps and flop down cage doors. to me, the bridges with gaps cause the same hazard.

Would you rather have a toe pinched or a leg snapped in two?

 

[AZChins]

If the spaces are large enough, the chin's foot could fall through and get caught. As the chin tries to get loose it could fall down off the bridge with the leg still caught and the the leg could break or sustain a really bad break. Sure, when the spacing is small enough and the leg can't get through it would be safe, but we know how wide chin feet are and it doesn't take too wide a space for them to get in trouble. 1"x1/2" spaces are too large and have broken chin legs many times before. My rule for this is anything bigger than 1/2"x1/2" is too big and needs to be removed for safety.

 

[chechinchillas]

I had a chin run up the wall and do a somersault and get it's foot stuck in 1/2" by 1" cage wire and hang there breaking her ankle. I have never had a toe, foot or any part of a chin injured on one of the bridges and I have several with many 6 months old playing on them.

 

[Essentia]

Unfortunately I don't have a photo as I didn't think to take one at the time. I am one of the people who has had a chinchilla get their leg caught in a bridge like that, which is why it makes me cringe each and every time I see one in a cage or someone selling one. While he didn't break the leg, it was a VERY bad sprain. I can show you a picture of the chins ankle joint if you would like. He has a permanent misshapen joint, and the vet believes he may have some arthritis.

Some people believe that the spacers are needed as chins will pinch toes if not. I have never had a single pinched toe here without the spacers. If in the very unlikelihood it did happen, I would much rather have a pinched toe than a broken leg with permanent damage.

 

[ticklechin]

If you would not have that spacing on the floor of the cage, why would you have it in a bridge.

 

[chechinchillas]

what if the bridges had 1/4" x 1/4" mesh lining underneath so there isn't any possible way for a foot to fall through, but the poop can still fall through.

 

[Stackie]

what if the bridges had 1/4" x 1/4" mesh lining underneath so there isn't any possible way for a foot to fall through, but the poop can still fall through.

They could still slip through the slats. Maybe not all the way through, but still enough to do damage.

I would never use these bridges. I'm another one that used bridges without any spacers for years with chins who bounced all over them and never had any problems. If you get the slats on tight enough and tie the wire right, they won't shift.

 

[chechinchillas]

You mean they could trip? They are very coordinated animals, adept at jumping, landing, etc. Pinch toes probably happen much more than noticed because they get pinched and then released. I am always open on hearing how to improve something or make it safer. I don't make these bridges myself, but have experience using them with many chins and no injuries. Chins can get injured in the safest of cages and so far I have only heard one person say their chin got injured on one. I had the one chin get injured on my cage wire, does that mean all the 1/2" x 1" cage wire walls are not safe too?

 

[Essentia]

While chins CAN get injured anywhere, something like this with open areas for a leg to slip through is ASKING for your chin to break a leg. Just because it hasn't happened to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I have heard of at least 3-4 chins that have hurt themselves on this type of bridge. This is a known hazard in the chinchilla community, which is why most people swear against them. It's also the same reason we don't recommend the wire hay racks. Same type of deal. Chins run around all crazy, get a leg stuck, hang upside down, break a leg, or perish from the stress and fear if someone isn't home to help them. While this sounds like I am just being negative, it has happened, and happened a lot.

 

[Brittany]

We had a chin get her foot caught in floor spacing that was 1" x 1/2". The foot twisted and one of her toes got caught so she couldn't get herself out. Luckily my boyfriend and the vets where able to cut her out and she didn't break anything. He posted it on here years ago, but his computer crashed so the photos are no longer available.

 

[Claire D]

They are very coordinated animals, adept at jumping, landing, etc.

Really? These would be the same animals that mistime jumps, crash to the floor of cages as they miss the ledge, and occasionally run into objects when they are out for a run ........... I don't think chins are particularly well coordinated at all. That's why they could hurt themselves in a padded cell.

Pinch toes probably happen much more than noticed because they get pinched and then released. I am always open on hearing how to improve something or make it safer. I don't make these bridges myself, but have experience using them with many chins and no injuries. Chins can get injured in the safest of cages and so far I have only heard one person say their chin got injured on one.

Several years ago I had a chin catch and damage toes in a similar item when the slats moved, leaving spaces between them. He broke his toe & needed treatment. So yes, it is possible.

If a chin comes into Monty's Manor with an open spaced bridge in the cage then I remove it immediately.

You have a vested interest in positively supporting these bridges, we all know that, & your defense is commendable but these bridges with spaces in are not as safe as certain people like to make out.

So I'll wait for you to tell me that the experience with my chinchillas was a fluke now then.


Keeping chinchillas safe is often about reducing or minimising risk - having had experience of these types of cage adornments I certainly would not use them again.

 

[chechinchillas]

I keep looking at the bridge and I can't see how a chin's foot could get caught. It could slip through, but they would just push up with their other feet. Their body is too fat to fall through and hang upside down, plus the bead would stop them from doing that anyways. If a leg slipped through and they fell they would just topple off. The slat opening is too long to keep the foot caught, it would slip out. I haven't heard of any other chins getting hurt on this bridge and certainly no proof.

 

[chechinchillas]

I get absolutely NOTHING if these bridges sell or they don't. I let people who make chin items list them for FREE on my website for my customers and I try any item listed on my site before I list them. The pinched toes are from bridges WITHOUT the bead spacers, how could the toe get pinched in the bridges with the spacers? I would never use wire flooring on a cage bottom or shelf, I used a pan with shavings.

 

[ChinnyMom]

thanks all!

for those that have posted with their specific negative experiences with these bridges, would i be allowed to copy and paste what you have said here to the other forum? i would leave out member names of course. and just want to double check with the mods that this is allowed?

 

[Claire D]

I keep looking at the bridge and I can't see how a chin's foot could get caught. It could slip through, but they would just push up with their other feet. Their body is too fat to fall through and hang upside down, plus the bead would stop them from doing that anyways. If a leg slipped through and they fell they would just topple off. The slat opening is too long to keep the foot caught, it would slip out. I haven't heard of any other chins getting hurt on this bridge and certainly no proof.

I get absolutely NOTHING if these bridges sell or they don't. I let people who make chin items list them for FREE on my website for my customers and I try any item listed on my site before I list them. The pinched toes are from bridges WITHOUT the bead spacers, how could the toe get pinched in the bridges with the spacers? I would never use wire flooring on a cage bottom or shelf, I used a pan with shavings.

Squeal & protest all you like but don't call into question the experiences being shared by people who have had problems - unless you wish to call them liars? That's not a route you want to be taking.

As Stackie said above, bridges without slack do not cause problems. If they are designed & constructed correctly then there is no slack between the slats & there is no gap for toes to get trapped in.

Bridges with spacers (of whatever type) do allow toes to get caught. On top of that, if a chin nibbles the spacer bead/wood then there is greater potential for the slats to move & trap toes or, if wide enough, a leg.
Your experience of the chin chewing the wooden spacer & leaving a gap is not the same as a bridge with tightly fitted slats.

Also, when a chin gets it's foot/leg caught in something they rarely (if ever) lift their foot straight up & out of the gap - they do try but usually their foot is twisted already. They don't have the ability to reason & work out they need to straighten the limb & then lift it out of the gap safely. It is this natural twisting/turning motion (at speed & often in a panic) which causes the injuries. Your theory is fatally flawed I am afraid.

There are people on this forum sharing GENUINE experiences of their chins having problems with bridges of this type.
IF there is a gap between slats, whether it is there due to spacer beads or not, then there is a risk (& yes, a proven risk) of chins getting their toes or legs caught & injured.


These bridges are, in my experience, an accident waiting to happen - I wouldn't ever use them or recommend them & certainly not for small or young chins with little limbs/toes.

 

[Claire D]

for those that have posted with their specific negative experiences with these bridges, would i be allowed to copy and paste what you have said here to the other forum? i would leave out member names of course. and just want to double check with the mods that this is allowed?

You may well be banging your head against a brick wall, especially if the person(s) who makes money from these types of bridge is/are on the forum - you will get into all sorts of arguments (as we have seen here on CnH).

Personally I would rather you linked to this thread (unless the other forum does not allow that?) or get the person(s) concerned to join here. I have had stuff copied & pasted before now & then a raging flame-fest ensue with no opportunity for me to respond. I also think sometimes comments are taken completely out of context which causes all sorts of problems & misunderstandings.

 

[ChinnyMom]

i don't think the other forum allows linking like you mention. i will encourage this other forum member to join here.

if i were to copy and paste, it would be only the pertinent parts of the posts that describe what exactly happened with the chin and the bridge, the rest would not be copied.

 

[AZChins]

I wish that I had the time to compile a list of all the times that I have had people tell me about their chins getting caught up in something in the cage. Broken legs, dead tissue from a lack of blood flow to a limb, wounds, removal of feet by chewing them off when the chins get caught, etc etc etc.

With chins you have to think ahead and if there is a chance of them getting hurt, remove whatever that is. I can tell you from experience what will keep the chins safer. I do use wire floors, but I use the right wire floors...and I make sure that anything I use in the cage has no pinch points.

There's always going to be some degree of risk with any cage that is used. You should ask ranchers about how the chins get their incisors caught in the sides and tops of the cages! It's bizarre how chins can get hurt.

Hammocks sold at petstores have been a huge problem with people in Arizona. I can think of almost a dozen instances where the chins have gotten tangled in them and had broken legs and feet. I warn people about those now.

The bridges look like they could pose a risk. Take the beads out and make sure that there's no pinch points between the slats, it's okay. It was a cute idea, but any space either needs to be very tiny or large enough for the entire chin to fit through to prevent injury. I know that in my herd I would really hate myself if someone got injured and it was because I didn't take something out when I was warned. (Last time that happened I didn't take a wheel out of the cage and a chin died. It was my fault that she is no longer alive!)

 

[Brittany]

I have two points that I would like to contribute to this discussion.

First off, the bar spacing on FN/CN ladders is only 1/2" wide, yet we encourage people to remove them or get fleece covers. Midwest is now selling Ferret Nations with bright blue fleece covers (I applaud them for taking a step in the right direction, now if we could get them to replace the plastic with metal they'd be all set). If a major company thinks it's important to cover up such small spacing, then surely dedicated chin enthusiasts should know better.

Second, I know many members have suspension bridges. I think they're cute, but it is my personal opinion that they are too dangerous to have in a cage. Alli makes great squiggle bridges that mount to the wall of the cage. They are fun, and SAFE!! If it's a matter of utilizing the center of the cage, it's easy enough to make a solid shelf that spans across the cage. There is nothing a suspension bridge (of any kind) can offer, that can't be met by a solid, safe, sturdy piece of wood. Again I know many reputable members of this forum have used suspension bridges, but I will never expose my animals to that kind of risk.