Backyard Breeders

[kogia]

Is it just me or is it freaking ridiculous that people feel totally OK with selling chinchillas for an extraordinary price and the only reason is because they've been "well handled" and have "great color genes". No mention of show/quality evaluation on the parents behalf! Gah, the NERVE of some people!


(sorry I had to rant)

 

[nicky]

Yeah, I agree. There's alot of people that are out there trying to make a buck off animals. It's all animals, not just chins. People now are breeding two pure breed dogs and selling them for extraordinary prices, when really they're just a mutts. It's not just you, it really is ridiculous.

 

[AZChins]

The funny thing is that even with nice animals it is difficult to make anything off of them. So, people with not so nice animals have a huge disadvantage in the making money department. Not to mention that chins are extremely non-prolific with a very long gestation and nursing period.

 

[starleomach]

There are a lot of bad breeders out there, just as their are good. But there are bad buyers and good buyers as well. If you think the breeder is bad just don't purchase from them. I never understand how people think you make money breeding animals..if so I am doing it wrong.....

 

[AZChins]

I'm going it wrong, as well.

 

[nicky]

I totally agree. That's why people jack up their prices. They're in it for the wrong reasons. When it comes down to it, people like that don't care about their animals or who they're ripping off. They just want to make quick cash. The only way you can make quick cash off of chins is to over price, and you probably still wouldn't make that much of a profit. Litter, pellets, hay, electricity (i wouldn't keep my house nearly as cool as I do in the summer if it wasn't for the chins), time, toys.... By the time you're done with it, really no profit. That's with all animals, when they're properly cared for.

 

[ABBY W.]

That assumes that they care enough to properly care for them. Unfortunately, the people who breed to make money don't typically have the animals' best interests at heart, so why would they provide them with good quality food and hay, let alone toys and regular dust baths! Those kinds of people give hobby breeders a bad name!

 

[kogia]

Glad I'm not alone. I'm very glad that chins do have limitations on their own physiology in terms of breeding- I think in a way it helps prevent a problem that could be much much worse. (Could you imagine mice/rabbit-like proliferation of chinnies?!)

Anywho, I just found a BYB who's bread two chins who have a show history (previous owner showed) and no history of malocclusion(sp?). I'm thinking that I'll take one of her kits- very cute! Plus, she knows her stuff.

 

[tunes]

Keep in mind, any breeder anywhere can ask whatever they want for a chin. I can ask $650.00 for a gorgeous white violet girl I have here if I want to. Do you have to pay it? No, definitely not. The only reason they are asking the prices they are is because they are getting them. So yes, some people do make money at selling chins. They probably also don't have 100 or more chins so that their overhead isn't terribly high.

It does suck, I agree. I've watched the prices for good quality chinchillas go down and down into the toilet because everybody is a "breader" now. When I first started, you couldn't touch an extra-dark eb for under $4-500.00. Now look. You can get them all day long for $150.00. Are they the same quality? Of course not. But when a person is buying a pet chin, or a backyard breeder is buying more crap for breeding, do you think they care?

Bottom line, as long as someone is willing to pay the price, people can ask whatever they want for whatever quality they have.

 

[eroomlorac]

I've watched the prices for good quality chinchillas go down and down into the toilet because everybody is a "breader" now.

:hilarious:

 

[TBFchins]

I think that one of the reasons that prices have decreased on Non -shown chins is the fact that people are becoming more knowledgegable about how to produce show quality chins. They understand that even chins that have placed well at shows many times won't produce show quality offspring.
So for many of us that are breeding to "improve the breed" and to produce show quality animals won't buy animals based on "parents are show quality" or "parents recieved such and such place at a particular show.
Many of us will no longer buy chins sight unseen ,or at a age to young to determine quality.

 

[starleomach]

You will still pay for great animals I am picking up two standard males in a few weeks for 300 each. I am willing to pay it. people need to keep in mind though sometimes you get what you pay for. I reciently had someone come to me for a sapphire (7 months old 650 gram female definitly breedable) say 300 was too much...they went somewhere else because I was way over priced....paid 150 for a fully grown female got her home and called me up and said this girl only weighs 400..how come she is so much smaller.....


I think though there are many people out there still breeding, but not looking to improve and many pet people still just want a baby..any baby. It id just this forum is for chinchilla people so here has a lower pool. I get all kinds emailing me. I tend to make my website more expensive because it weeds people out. Often I will go down in price for the right home

 

[AZChins]

You are right, some people just want a baby. It's a matter of price most of the time. I don't think that I have ever charged over $200 for any chin no matter the color or quality. I hear constantly complaints about chins that are around the $140 to $150 range. Then people come here and try to talk me out of the babies that I am holding back for breeding...but they are unwilling to pay what they are worth.

To me six month old chins are much more valuable than three month old kits. I can figure out if I like them for breeding or not usually by six to eight months. You would be surprised at the number of people who think that because a chin isn't a little baby then it isn't worth as much...

 

[nicky]

I agree. Although I don't usually sell my adult chins (they're too precious to me), I have on occassion sold adults (with a pedigree) and have been told " $150 is more than I'm willing to pay. I could buy a baby for that". I definitely prefers adults or older kits to babies for a couple of reasons. You know what they have grown into and also their true personality comes out a little bit more with age. I have purchased sweet little kits that loved to held, and they as they have got a little older and independent, they didn't like to be held or they didn't like to be scratched or whatever any more. Kind of like kids, I guess. LOL. $140-$150 is really reasonable for a quality chin, kit or adult. Petsmart charges $170! No known history and usually not used to being handled! But, I still get compliants at times as well. I don't have that many pairs, so I don't produce that many a year. So, in turn I don't have to deal with too many people. I can't imagine what some of you ranchers must hear! LOL. I laugh, but I bet you guys hear and see some pretty stupid things.

 

[AZChins]

They can't negotiate on price with Petsmart, but they think that they can with someone running a small business. I don't like it when people try to negotiate with me because I always give a very good deal and there are usually so many extras that I give out that more than make up for it. People are just jerks, opportunist jerks. When placed in the same situation they would charge MUCH MUCH more! I have a "customer" that I am dealing with currently that is very much like that. It makes me sick to my stomach to think about it. But, you know what, I did nothing wrong. I trusted the wrong person with a couple of beautiful little rescue girls, this person is only making herself look really bad to a few people not just me.

 

[Spoof]

Supply and demand was mentioned in the first post, but the supply hasn't become larger, and the demand hasn't gone away. It's that the avenues for people to connect have gotten better (internet). What it's really all about is marketing.

As a breeder you're looking at it through different beer goggles. Think like a pet person, say you wanted to get a Ragdoll cat (or some other animal you've only seen once). The only things you're going to know in this modern age are what's in the newspaper, what Google brings up or if you're real lucky, a friend of a friend of a friend.

Does the Google pages having nothing for sale mean that there are none to be had? No, there's probably a glut but nobody advertises correctly. Where they do advertise (likely at shows), nobody pet related is looking.

)

Worded terribly but I've been reading magazines and my grammar has gone to pot this week.

 

[Riven]

Hey... my chins are in my backyard... I think the title is misleading! At one time they were in the front yard along the driveway, but I got sick of the neighbors staring at me going in and out of there all the time....

Today at the auction some pet store chin breeder lady ( she breeds whatever, she just breeds for pets you know... so things like health don't matter. She also left a broken leg untreated for at least three weeks... so don't get me started) she brought four females to the auction today... they all sold for less than $15 and the clerk lady got stuck with two of them for $10. Yup... really running up the market on them. After commission that's like... $8 each.. I hope this and the current low chin prices at auctions around here make her think about it more instead of just popping them out.

The sad part about this is if I buy them as rescues... it only encourages her to make more.

 

[xcoronaangel]

I am glad you guys posted this. I was unsure if you had "backyard" breeders with chinchillas or if you called them something different.
When I first started looking for my current boys I was unsure if people did breed chinchillas like they do other animals (cats/dogs)... I wasn’t sure if there was a high enough demand for them to produce backyard breeders who thought they could make a profit.

I agree with the person who said there are people out there who just breed to make money BUT I think a big % of it too is ignorance. I get TONS of people coming in the hospital still today who don't know about how to properly take care of their basic pets... spay/neuter, shots ect. Also without proper info they think because their pet is "nice" on the eyes and it is nice to them it is Breeder quality. They don't know about testing and what it takes to actually get an animal of quality you can breed...
I like one of my vets b/c he always asks people when they say they don’t want to spay/neuter or separate males and females when it comes to small animals-- Why? What are you going to do with the babies? (But he also respects the fact that they have a right to not spay/neuter- at least for now they do maybe in a few years the LA law will follow down here)-- even last night a very nice family who clearly loved their animals said "just give them to nice families like everyone else does." <-- Every day people aren't aware of just how much the pet population is over populated. They don't go to shelters all the time and they don’t shift through endless emails about people no longer wanting their pets or caring about them.
I have and always will support ethical breeders who breed for a purpose. Not too many people in the rescue world of dogs/cats though believe the same thing though I have found.

 

[Riven]

As indicated above I greatly dislike the term "backyard" breeder, and think it should be replaced with unethical breeders. Yes it's a more harsh term and people don't like it. Isn't that even more reason to use it? To get the point across? Americans used to be people who fought for their beliefs, and most of them anymore are a bunch of people who just pussy foot around scared to upset other people or make them feel bad even if it's what they are.

Anyway people who don't know, often hear this and think if someone only has a couple animals they are automatically a backyard breeder, and this is not true. I could have one pair of anything and breed them, and show then sell the offspring even taking say a National award with them, and I am an ethical breeder. They often associate that term with the amount of animals a person has, not with the care and consideration they take in using the amount of animals they have.

Similar to hoarder... my mom called me a hoarder yesterday and told Randy NOT to sell me an alpaca...

 

[kogia]

The term "backyard breeder" is already wildly used in different pet/livestock circles and generally have the attached feeling of a person who breeds animal X but really has no idea what they are doing (most of the time to see the kaooot babies). A really awesome blog that goes after BYB in horses is fuglyblog.com. I wonder if we could get a blog/page up to maybe publicize the issue.