Thiamine Deficiency

[feistychins]

When a chin has seizures and it is believed that it is because of a Thiamine deficiency, what is the best source to give a chin?

I know as natural sources oats, brewers yeast, barley and sunflower seeds are high in natural Thiamine. Of course all these things are not the best to give your chin and the amounts would most likely have to be very high to make up for any deficiency.

If someone has given their chin a supplement source of Thiamine, what have you used and how much?

 

[MegM]

Brewer's yeast is one of the best but you could add wheat germ & oats to your current supplement. You could also check w/Dawnna (Chocolate Chinchillas) & see if she makes a supplement high in Thiamine.

 

[feistychins]

I don't have a chin with this issue, but just wanted to know what has been used with success by others.

 

[Dustbunnies]

Any more opinions on this? My Pepper has had 4 seizures in two months. Karo syrup did not do anything as far as we can tell. I asked the vet about thiamine deficiency and he said it could be and to try giving her some b vitamins. I thought about just trying a little wheat germ by itself....any thoughts? How much?

I hate that she has seizures, especially not knowing the cause. She is on oxbow pellets, ADP hay, Pur water, and some lifeline for good measure.

I did not see anything on Dawnna's site for this.

 

[Riven]

I'm not sure why the vet would suggest karo syrup, chins are not like other critters that have tendencies to have insulin problems. That actually concerns me a little, as they should be basically sugar free.

The easiest quickest way to bring up thiamine levels would be to just give a Vitamin B1 supplement, can be found in the vitamin isle. But I would make sure that is a problem for sure. You can OD from thiamine, and it can cause deficiencies in other vitamins if in too high concentration. I'd guess based on human RDA that for a chin it would be around 0.1 mg /day.

 

[Dustbunnies]

It wasn't the vet, it was the forum. There are several places on the forum where karo is suggested to find out if they are hypoglycemic seizures. And just a tiny bit (on the gums if while seizing to bring them out of it if due to low blood sugar).

And I wouldn't want to overdo the vitamin B, that is why I was thinking of wheat germ. It is in Ryerson's supplement.

I guess I was wondering if anyone has every had a chin with proven thiamine deficiency seizures or something similar?

 

[Riven]

A vet with up to date equipment should be able to run a vitamin panel for you, ask your vet if they will, could help you out.

Have you thought about trying a different feed? Oxbow is great, but it might be causing the problem if that chin has special or different needs. Here is an interesting article about seizures in dogs ( epilepsy to be exact ) which is kind of an interesting read, it talks about possible connections between grains and seizures.

http://www.canine-epilepsy.com/healthydiet.html#connection

I'm not saying that a chin can't be hypoglycemic, but I've never seen evidence of such a thing. If there is I'd be very interested in seeing it. Chins would actually have more of a tendency to probably be hyperglycemic as they are basically diabetics.

 

[Dustbunnies]

I know blood tests are possible. My vet didn't want to stress her with them at this point.

There seemed to be several posts alluding to hypoglycemic chins.

Maybe a new feed would be warranted, although I am not sure how different it would be. It would be worth a try after a while, at least. It seems like removing grains from a chins diet would be...um...difficult.

 

[Riven]

LOL, removing all grains would not be ideal of course. Isn't Oxbow a timothy based feed? Perhaps he's ( she's? ) not getting enough protein.

Hypoglycemia is usually not a once in a while type deal, it is like diabetes and would need to be maintained with on a regular basis. If a chins diet, schedule doesn't change there should not be any random affects of it.

I'm not saying in any way it's not possible, or that there are not any posts suggesting it, and if anyone has dealt with this on a regular basis, has worked with their vet regarding it, etc. I would be interested in more knowledge.

ETA: I just checked and Oxbow pellet is a alfalfa base, it also contains B12 and thiamine in the recipe. The CC is a timothy base, that's what I was thinking of. Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Dustbunnies]

Well, maybe protein would help, but I definitely don't want to over do that. She is gaining fine. Maybe I'll buy her some alfalfa hay as a treat.

 

[Riven]

Hopefully you can find something that will help!