Hip Displaysia

[Rescue Momma]

I have a question and hopefully someone can tell me.
I have checked every Chinchilla forum I can find and have not seen one thing about this any where.
Do chins get hip displaysia? My emergency vet said Pepper has hip displaysia and that it probably would never have shown up because they are so light. But somehow he hurt his back right hip and was limping. (Long story this is the short version)
I saw the xray and it did not look like it was formed right. It was not a break it looked like the hip joint was not round like it should have been.
I have to take him back in the morning after a week of meds and have him checked.
She put him on Cosagen and meloxitin? Not spelled right I'm sure.
It seems to be better and he is getting around on the floor pretty good.
I just have not been able to find any information on this anywhere and another vet said it was not something that they are prone too.
But again the first vet said it may have never shown up had he not hurt it somehow. And that the fact that they are so light it may not be noticable later or cause him future problems.

I googled it and I got just about every other kind of animal but not Chins!
He doesn't act like it is something that will hinder him but he has been on flat ground for a week. And it has been a fairly confined area during the day and he gets floor time in the evening and it is all flat too. (Except when he wants to climb on me when I'm laying in the floor with him)

Thanks for any info or advice.

 

[Essentia]

I have never heard of hip displyasia in chins. I'm hoping some people who are more knowlegable than I am in something like this comes on.

I'm not saying your vet is wrong, but I would get a second opinion. I use Dr. Hart at Hidden Hills Animal Hospital. He is amazing and extremely chin knowledgeable. He also doesn't charge an arm and a leg.

 

[tunes]

Nope, I have never heard of it either. I wonder if the deformity could have originally been caused by an injury, falling, being dropped, getting stepped on, and now it mimicks what the vet thinks of as hip dysplasia.

I agree, a second opinion wouldn't be a bad idea.

Also, I can't find either of the drugs you mention on line or in any of my books. Do you have the correct spelling handy?

 

[equus_peduus]

Hip dysplasia sort of by definition is when the hip joint isn't formed properly. Usually in dogs, the socket is too shallow, so the ball of the joint doesn't fit in it well enough so you have an unstable joint. It's usually more of a problem in big dogs because the weight of the animal puts more stress on the joint. So I agree - it sounds like you have some kind of hip abnormality (and 'dysplasia' is as good a name for it as any), and under normal circumstances, it probably would never have shown up.

My best guess as to your drugs: Cosequin is a glucosamine/chondroitin supplement. Not sure how you're dosing it small enough for a chin though . Meloxicam = Metacam (drug name as opposed to brand name), for pain and inflammation.

 

[Rescue Momma]

Exactly...equus_peduus :thumbsup:
I saw the xray and the hip socket does don't come all the way around the joint like it should. The vet said if he had not hurt himself it may have never shown up.:chin1:
The meloxicam is what worries me...I'm on the same stuff and it is pretty rough on the stomach, liver etc.
He is only going to be on it for another couple of days so he should be ok.
The Cosequin however looks like he will have to take indefinately.
The part I really don't like is he lost a bunch of weight in a week.
Went from 758 grams to 715.:cry3:
I bought a scale and am going to weigh him regularly now. The vet said to try some greens but he doesn't like them. Romaine, parsely,mustard greens NOT!!!
She said to try banana and he eats some of it. I have given him a couple of baby carrots the last couple of days and he ate most of it. He is eating his oat supplement that I made them but not really any pellets. He eats his hay.
I give him his meds on a plain shredded wheat and put some strawberry jam on it and he eats it fine. The meloxicam goes on a raisin.
He eats a couple of Cheerios.
I'm thinking maybe the meds are making him not want to eat so I'm trying some different things to entice him.
The dosages are small .05 cc & 0.5 cc's.

He still is not really using the leg but he gets around on the floor just fine.
I still have him in a single layer cage. The vet said to try a small shelf.
I did and he didn't try to use the ramp he tried to just jump up on it and didn't make it. It scared me so I took it out until I have more time to supervise him.
He has his small carrier in there that he likes to sleep in and he jumps on it but it's small and soft.
He really isn't doing much and sleeps alot. When I give him floor time he runs then rests runs then rests. His stamina isn't what it was but he had a pretty tramatic event and he has been fairly confined for a week and a half.

I have an appointment with another vet the 25th. She is on vacation this week (of course) and the weekend is really the only time I can take him.
We'll see what the other vet says but other than surgery of some sort I don't know.
I'll keep you all informed.
I'm going to weigh him tonight and see what's up.:crossfingers:
Thanks for the help

 

[equus_peduus]

The meloxicam is what worries me...I'm on the same stuff and it is pretty rough on the stomach, liver etc.
He is only going to be on it for another couple of days so he should be ok.
The Cosequin however looks like he will have to take indefinately.

Meloxicam can be hard on liver, kidneys and gut. At appropriate doses, it should be ok. Monitor closely for any signs of lethargy, not eating, and changes in poop.

The vet said to try some greens but he doesn't like them. Romaine, parsely,mustard greens NOT!!!
She said to try banana and he eats some of it. I have given him a couple of baby carrots the last couple of days and he ate most of it. He is eating his oat supplement that I made them but not really any pellets. He eats his hay.
I give him his meds on a plain shredded wheat and put some strawberry jam on it and he eats it fine. The meloxicam goes on a raisin.
He eats a couple of Cheerios.

People around here are very hard on anything other than the pellets-and-hay diet (i.e., you'll find a lot of opposition to the greens and other veggies). Personally, I think that it's not a horrible problem if done appropriately, but should probably not be a major part of the diet. If he's not used to them, he probably won't eat them well, especially if he's already not feeling like eating. Stick to the pellets and hay. Get some Critical Care if he's not eating well and forcefeed. I'd stay away from anything with a lot of sugar (the jam! and dried fruits), because they can mess with the balance in the gut. There's some evidence that raisins and grapes can be toxic to dogs, and a lot of people around here are also very wary of giving raisins to chins for that reason. I haven't seen anything one way or the other, but I can definitely say that the sugar levels aren't all that great for the chins. The cheerios and shredded wheat, in very small amounts, are ok, but not as good as pellets and hay. The metacam is supposed to be sweet - some chins will take it on its own.

I'm thinking maybe the meds are making him not want to eat so I'm trying some different things to entice him.

might be. More likely the pain/discomfort. Get some Critical Care.

I didn't know Cosequin came as a liquid. Will have to look into it (maybe your vet compounded it, which is possible. I like the idea)

 

[Claire D]

We had a similar situation with a chinchilla who came into Roman & Jane's Chinchilla Rescue. Gregg was a little chin who arrived with terrible mobility problems.
He was examined and Xrayed - he had severe degeneration of the joints in his back legs, including his hips and knees. In fact, his hips were almost non-existent.
He was a quiet, determined little chap so he was put on pain relief, had an adapted cage, and was given regular acupuncture treatment - all of which helped him tremendously. In fact, the acupuncture was so effective that it was difficult to keep him mobilising gently (he wanted to belt around!) afterwards and it was obviously so comfortable having the treatment that he often fell asleep in our arms with the needles insitu.
Once his condition was stabilized, Gregg came to live in a specially adapted cage at Monty's Manor. This included a carpeted ramp, an underfloor heated nest box, and soft flooring to cushion his feet/legs. We would go back up to the rescue vet for his acupuncture once a month.
Gregg was an amazing little character, gentle but determined, and he even went to a show (much to the chagrin of some!) along with his Xrays to show the "other" side of breeding - he was so laid back that he spent most of the day in Roman's arms, wrapped in a blankie either having his head/face stroked or fast asleep. Nothing bothered little Gregg. :heart:

For anyone interested, some of his story is here on CHINformative.


One thing I would like to say about the Metacam/Meloxicam (and this is a personal philosophy which I discuss with my vet for every chin) - every drug has side effects. The key is in determining whether the benefits of pain relief outweigh the potential side effects. The other main consideration is longevity and whether the pain relief is required short or long term. For me, any chinchilla with a terminal or long term condition which requires pain relief should have it, despite the potential for side effects. If the condition is likely to kill the chinchilla quicker than any side effect from the drugs then we judge it worth the risks IMO. I'd rather have a shorter time with a chin that is pain free than a longer time with a chin that is in discomfort or pain – I view it in the same way as palliative care in humans. Having said that though, this is a clinical decision which I make with my vet for each chin as necessary.
With Gregg it was definitely worth the risks and he lived a comfortable life for as long as possible.


Good luck with this little chap.

 

[Rescue Momma]

Meloxicam can be hard on liver, kidneys and gut. At appropriate doses, it should be ok. Monitor closely for any signs of lethargy, not eating, and changes in poop.

He has been a little lethargic and not eating as well as he should but the poop is great!!!!! (Sorry had to do it) :dance3:

They did compound the meds into a liquid.

People around here are very hard on anything other than the pellets-and-hay diet (i.e., you'll find a lot of opposition to the greens and other veggies).

I have been checking this site and others out for awhile. I was expecting some flak (don't mean that in a bad way) on the food issues and am good with it.
I'm not thin skinned and I came on here asking for advice and I appreciate you all taking the time to give it.
Many of you have a lot more experience with Chins than I do so I appreciate the wisdom and stories.:thumbsup:
I have done a ton of research but it does not compare to real life experience.

I have been very conservative on what he gets but have had to try several different things to get him his meds and to eat.
Like I said he lost a lot of weight in a week and the vet was concerned.
He lost 43 grams in one week.
From what I have read on some sites, the up and coming vets think the greens are OK.
Mine is a young woman and I don't think she has been out of vet school long.
She suggested I try and give him a meal worm..... Uh NO!!!!!
I told her no straight up.

Jam---Only a very light coat on the shredded wheat because of the sugar.

Raisin--One a day with the Meloxicam on it. The meloxicam will end on Saturday.

Greens---He has no real interest in them so it is almost a mute point.

Cheerios--- He hasn't had much interest in them either.

Pellets--- I don't think he is eating them. And if he is it is a very small amount.

Bananas---Fresh and just a small piece of the end. He is not getting any dried fruit because of the sugar.

Apple---- Small piece about every other day.

Pear---He loved it and ate some of it.

Grapes--- Once in a great while and only half of one.

Hay---Lots and he seems to be eating it more than anything else.

Where do I get the critical care? Pet store, Vet?

Like I said he is going to the vet I had chosen orginally but they don't do emergencies.:banghead:

Claire:
I agree as long as he is not in pain I can deal with him limping around. And I think he runs faster now that before he hurt himself!!! :thumbsup:
Although he has to rest afterward. I hope he will at least be able to have another small level and I'm thinking his wheel is not coming back.
But he will just have to get extra floor time then.
I may have to check into the accupuncture that would be fantastic.

Thank you all again I have gotten some good ideas now.
Sorry to be so long winded.

 

[saphire]

Bananas---Fresh and just a small piece of the end. He is not getting any dried fruit because of the sugar.
Oxbow has banana or strawberry freeze dried treats. the only ingredient is the fruit. though I should let you know.
You can get the Critical Care at your vet.

 

[ticklechin]

I would rather see him eat healthy things rather than the sugar stuff, Critical care with either pumpkin or blackstrap molasses added for flavor, Critical care and Lifeline (www.chocolatechinchillas.com) mixed 50/50, or just some lifeline which is better than the jam on the wheat or the fresh fruits. He needs what Critical care has in it since he is not eating pellets and rather than fill the tummy with candy, give him something more nutritional.

 

[mistywaterwoman]

My chihuahua has Hip Dysplasia and we are managing it with a glucosamine & chondroitin supplement, but it's been VERY hard getting the dose small enough for him to tolerate. He's only around 8lbs. It's been hard on his stomach, I can't imagine trying to treat a chin with it.

 

[Rescue Momma]

Update....Jeez
To start with my home computer got a bug so it's down. That's why I have not responded before now.

I took Pepper to the other vet and now I don't have a freakin clue :hair:
According to her he does not have hip displaysia...it's arthritis in the knee.
But when she looked at the xrays she didn't know what a "normal" chin hip socket looked like!
However..... his hurt leg is larger than the other one and she says it is from the arthritis getting worse and the bones are changing.
I tend to agree

Long story short he will stay on the cosiquin and she wants me to give him the Meloxicam every other day for the pain.
I'm not so sure that I'm going to do that since it is so harsh on the system.
So we fix the leg and then he gets an ulcer from the meds!!!!
The other option is surgery but then they will just fuze the joint together and he may have a harder time getting around.

He is getting around great! He tends to favor that leg a little but it has not slowed him down much.
I put his wheel back in his cage the other night and he gets on it and swings. I really haven't seen him run full tilt on it but he goes up and down the ramp like it's nothing.

Does anyone have any info on soybeans & I can't remember what the other thing she said at the moment. When I do I'll come back and ask.
But she didn't know if they could eat soybeans but they are supposed to be good for arthritis.

So all I know is he is injured but not to the point that it is kepping him from leading a normal life and all I can do is try to keep him pain free.
Which he seems to be!!!!