Question about chin sizes and breeding

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gfrazier90

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
5
Location
Florida
Hey everyone,
I am new to breeding and am in the process of getting some stock to get me started. I have been reading and doing a lot of research and I see all these people wanting to buy these larger 900+ gram chins for breeding and show. I am also reading about how these chins are also slow producers and may have health problems. I already have a pink white female that is 701 grams full grown. What would be the ideal size to breed her to? I am looking at a couple different males. Both are high quality males and are full grown. One is a little under 700 grams and the other is almost 900 grams. I am possibly wanting to get into showing in the future so I want to spend my money on a male that will serve me well once I take the jump into that, but I don't want him to be too big for my female right now.
 
A good question, I'd be interested in some input from different breeders on how to match up sizes, male vs female. Also how important is size matching vs the other quality matching like fur density, color, ect... Mostly in regards to raising show animals too. ^^
 
Regarding which male to buy/use I don't base my decision on the weight alone. I would take a smaller male with great fur density, strength and clarity or a larger male. I would recommend getting a male that betters the female quality. You would want a male that has strength were the female is falling short. I have a couple 700-800 gram females in breeding with 900 gram males and they don't have a problem with breeding.
 
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Personally, I would stay away from the larger male simply because I would worry about kits being too large and the mom having problems birthing a large kit.
 
Adult size has nothing to do with kit size. As long as a male is over 600 grams I dont consider size beyond that. At that point is about color, density, confirmation and such. What do you feel your female can improve on? What is her strengths? What qualities are the males bringing to the match?
 
I am just getting started, so I am by no means an expert on evaluating chins lol. From what I have seen and read I believe my white female has a good head and neck. I think she could use a bit more density in her fur and maybe a little more blocky through the shoulders. The males have really good veiling and conformation. I am sure as a go along I will add higher quality females to my program and I won't be basing my herd off of this female. But I'd like to get my feet wet so to speak before I start dropping big money on more than 1 chin. I think I will end up going with the smaller male, just to give me peace of mind. But with all else being equal, would a larger chin place above a more moderate sized one at a show? Or is it just a judges preference?
 
I don't use any chin over 900 grams. I have seen more birthing issues in larger chins and slower breeders. So the biggest difference in size is 300 grams. A 30 gram kit can grow to be 1000 grams or 400 grams so large size doesn't mean birthing weights. When getting to the larger size I always ask what the kit weight was to give a slight idea of what runs in the family lines. Some throw larger kits and need larger hips and some throw smaller. It varries. Hip size is more important in the female than the male size.
 
seachin said:
Really? So you've bred lots of smaller females with very large males without problems?
Click to expand...

I've never seen a problem with kit size for females smaller than the sire and don't believe it is something you need to consider. How the animals compliment each other for improvement is how they should be paired. Clarity and fur quality are my first priorities. Cat75 describes it well.
 
I'm with everyone else, I have 1000g females in with 600g males and I have 600g females in with 900g males. Weight isn't and has never been an issue here regarding kit size.

I say, pick the best overall male. If they're both about equal in all areas except size, size wins. If they're not, then you try to compliment your female. For example, assuming your pink white is like a lot of pink whites and suffers from a little creaminess you'll want to take the clearer male regardless of his size...if she suffers soft fur like a lot of whites you'll want the male that has the stronger more stand up fur.
 
Many people will use a standard for a PW. And what color phase of standard is a consideration. Light or medium phase with an ultra bright white belly with a large band across its white chest would be my personal pick. Use the fur length of your PW when looking for a male.

You could breed it to another mutation. However that animal better be "spot on" in color. Have size. Same fur length to match your PW, and have a tight dense coat. Think velvet tight fur with the same smoothness across the coat. Stay away from animals with soft swirls or twists to the fur pattern. I understand that is inherited and can be passed on.

Before you even breed the PW, you should make sure that animal is as clean clear colored as possible without any yellow. AKA: creamy

One of the notes I made at the Shindig was regarding large size to large size breeding.
Beth Ann was giving a presentation and made the following comments:
Big to big do not breed well. They have less offspring or litters that are dead. Or small and dead.

I do not know if that is true as I have not breed two huge animals.

Have you been to any shows to see all the variables to animals? I would highly recommend you try that before spending your money.

Know your breeder! I cannot stress that enough. They should be well known in the chin community as either ranchers or hobby breeders. Willing to answer any tough question. If they do not talk about some of the already posted great ideas or ask the color of your female then......RUN!! Save your money and wait for the right animal. You'll be so glad you did.

By the way there is going to be a fall show in Orlando Florida November 2nd. Many times a good breeder will list animals for sale prior to a show and bring them. Some can be put on hold with a deposit with balance due at the show. Or if its a claim show the animals will be for sale at the show. Either shown or on a "for sale" table.
See link below for info regarding the November MCBA show.

http://www.centralfloridachinchillas.com/
 
In most cases yes. A larger male is usually slower at getting females bred but there are always exceptions to every rule.
 
Adult size absolutely does not dictate kit size...this is true for all mammals. The size of the baby is not proportional to the size of the adult producing the baby. I have had 70g kits born to 700g females paired to 650g-700g males while my 900g animals have produced kits in the 40g range. My average weight is about 52g for newborn babies and that is usually what I see for my females, regardless of their size or the size of their mates.

I have a 940g male in breeding and he does just fine. He produced 6 kits within five months of being in breeding here. Big males CAN be lazy and slow, but that typically happens if they are overweight. My boy is just a big guy...not really any fat on him. So he's very active and he likes to breed his ladies. A big fat boy might be more bothered by the activity of breeding. ;) Big females should be about the same except as a female gets heavier, fat accumulates around the ovaries which will slow production and interfere with ovulation. Getting a fat chin slim will help in determining if the animal is just a slow producer or if they are having reproductive issues from being overweight.

To the OP, it would be a good idea to try to purchase an animal that is already proven in show. You at least have the animal's placing to help determine the breeding quality since you have not yet developed an eye for quality. Basically, a 1st place animal is desirable and good breeding quality. For each major fault the animal has, it goes down a placing on the table. So a 2nd place animal has one major fault...3rd place has two major faults and so on. Starting with as high of quality as you can get will help you're breeding program.
 
I have not found my big males to be slow or lazy in breeding. I just had a 900 gr male give me 4 litters within 3 weeks of each other. Popped a beige in there last week and he already bred her. It applies to my other males as well.
 
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