None of the vets I've been to knows what's wrong with my chin

[Stefan Lundmark]

Hi,

Sorry if I'm going to be long-winded. I'm really desperate. If anyone has the time and patience to read all this, thank you so much!

I've got a chinchilla, Egon. He's thirteen years old. I've been to over a dozen of different vets all over Sweden and no one understands why he has trouble eating. It's so frustrating and he's getting worse every day.

Background
Five years ago, he started to crumble some of his pellets when he was eating. He pawed at his mouth but kept eating. We noticed his top-left incisor was curved and white (the others were yellow and straight) so we took him to the vet, who trimmed it down. We did this every 3 months or so.

Over the years it got worse and we started to give him metacam. His regular vet said his back-teeth are worn down and not aligning very well. She said chinchilla teeth don't grow forever and that they might not grow back. We took him to another vet for an x-ray and they said he has malocclusion and that there's a high chance he was going to be dead in 12 months. This vet is one of the most reputable exotic vets in Sweden. That was 4 years ago.

Recently
Egon stopped eating on his own. I had to mix down his pellets with water and he ate that with delight. He's still very energic and doesn't seem to be in any pain as long as he's not eating. He's started to chew on cage-bars more often which is odd to me - wouldn't that hurt?

My regular vet says he's got a foul smell from his back teeth and that it might be an infection. He was perscribed antibiotics but suddenly he got a lot better and started eating on his own again so we never gave him any antibiotics. His left eye was wet from time to time and his breathing can be heard like he's got a cold.

I've been to four vets during this time and no one can see any issues on his respitory system. The vet which diagnosed malocclusion says it might be his airways are getting pressured from the roots?

Now
Egon has stopped eating anything but very thin Critical Care mixed with lots of water. He's got a lot of appetite on that but struggles with anything else. He paws (and sometimes he sneezes) when I give him his metacam. His left eye has also started to water itself.

We went back to the malloclusion-vet and they did another x-ray. They say his malocclusion has gotten worse and that we're not allowed to leave the place before we make a decision, either put him down or let them put him in for surgery, which is only a temporary fix anyway.

We left anyway and went to my regular vet and they found a scratch on his eye. He was given eye-drops (with antibiotics) - which I've been unable to use yet because he struggles when I try to. My regular vet says from what she can tell he's in good shape except for his back teeth and the fact that he's getting old. She can't figure out why he doesn't eat.

He's still very very happy, chirps and runs around. But I've noticed he sleeps more. Is there anything I can do? Could there be a crack in his front tooth? He's a cage-bar-chewer.

I've attached both x-rays. Thanks a ton for your time.

/Steve

X-rays 2010

X-rays 2016

 

[Kokorobosoi]

In my opinion, the malo vet was correct. The roots look to be pushing through his skull now. They look pretty close to his eye as well. I know it's not the answer you want to hear....

But give him a play date with a ginormous dust bath like he has never seen before, and bring him back to the malo vet. If he were mine, I would want him to stop suffering, and that x Ray is screaming pain to me. I'm so sorry.

 

[ticklechin]

I agree, its advanced elongation and frankly being 13+ years old any treatment will be risky.

 

[Stefan Lundmark]

Thank you both for your time, I really appreciate it. I'm so lost.

Should I really put him down when he's still able to play? He doesn't seem in much pain when not eating. I guess you're saying that he's masking it?

You mentioned treatment, Dawn: isn't that always temporary in the case of malo?

 

[Amethyst]

I agree it looks like bad elongation, one thing that might clear things up for you info wise is that chin's teeth grow in both directions. So not only the crown of the tooth grows, but also the root can grow if the teeth are misaligned (malo). Chin's teeth don't have a root cap like humans or most other animals, so when their teeth start running out of room in the mouth it signals for the roots to grow into the skull instead. So yes the sinuses are most likely getting squeezed shut by the roots of the teeth. All their teeth grow too, front and back teeth, I have never heard of a chin's teeth stop growing, unless the teeth are dead (caused by trauma or bad infection). Seeing as some chins live into their 20s the idea that their teeth stop growing in their early teens doesn't make sense. Also each chin's teeth grow at a different rate, so the malo vet probably had see it before and that chin went down hill faster, which is why they figured 12 months. There is no cure for malo, unless you pull out all the chin's teeth which is likely to break the jaw and/or get infected (very much not advised). You can get regular teeth trimming/filing for the tooth crowns every 3-6 months (risky for a young healthy chin, even more so for an older one), but nothing can be done about the roots, so you are just delaying the inevitable. The roots will just continue to grow until they puncture something vital and the chin dies.

I understand that he appears to be happy and fine, but chins hide pain until they physically can't, so by the time they show signs of pain, they are in excruciating pain.

 

[Stefan Lundmark]

Thank you Amethyst. That's not the answer I wanted to hear, but thank you for filling me in on some of the question marks.

I'm just frustrated there's so limited research on this. I've read some papers on nutritional malocclusion and that in some cases the roots have recessed when given Vitamin C and Calcium. Has anyone else tried this?

I'm NOT getting my hopes up and I won't be playing around with Calcium, but I'd like to try giving him some Vitamin C supplements.

 

[Kokorobosoi]

Sweetie I'm so sorry. I wish I could just reach through the screen and hug you. What I'm going to say is so painful, and I'm tearing up for you.

Your chin is in pain. Right now, when he eats, when he plays. Sometimes animals hide their pain so well that we want to believe there is more time. I've been there, in that **** where we have to make a hard choice. And to me, my pain in losing a cherished fur baby is nothing to knowing that my little one is hurting and there is only one way to fix it.

I don't want you to get up one day and find him past the point he can hide it. Or worse. I think it would be better for both of you to reconsider the vit c/calcium treatments. I'm so very sorry and I truly wish I had a solution for you.

 

[mercynursie]

Not what you want to hear,but I agree with the others. When I have a animal that is showing sickness, I write down three things that I know they really enjoy. When they can't enjoy those things anymore, I know it is time to give my final gift of love, relief from pain and discomfort. Chins chew, they love chewing sticks, wood, etc. You say that he is eating,but hand feeding or even just feeding wet pellets is not a normal diet for chinchillas. If it was temporary as following illness I would do that, but to continue to feed like this with no end in sight isn't fair to a chinchilla. It is so hard to make the choice of euthanasia , but it really is a gift of love in return for all that the animal has given you during its life. I will be praying for you and your baby during this rough time of decision making.

 

[Stefan Lundmark]

Your chin is in pain. Right now, when he eats, when he plays. Sometimes animals hide their pain so well that we want to believe there is more time. I've been there, in that **** where we have to make a hard choice. And to me, my pain in losing a cherished fur baby is nothing to knowing that my little one is hurting and there is only one way to fix it.

Thanks Koko. This is my first chin (and last, I don't want to get this attached again). I know I'm not going to get popular for saying this, but I'm not convinced he's in chronical pain. Based on the x-rays, perhaps I should reconsider. But to me, it seems he's only in pain when he's eating.

Appreciate your thoughts and kind words. Rest assured I'm considering and preparing myself for a tough decision.

Not what you want to hear,but I agree with the others. When I have a animal that is showing sickness, I write down three things that I know they really enjoy. When they can't enjoy those things anymore, I know it is time to give my final gift of love, relief from pain and discomfort.

He's no different than before, he's just sleeping a little bit more and needs help eating. I know that's not normal, but he's still very bouncy, masking or not.

 

[Kokorobosoi]

Well I can't do any more, and It Would be cruel to say what I'm thinking right now, so I'll just wish your little one well.

 

[tunes]

Have you ever had a toothache? The kind that requires antibiotics and pain medications just so you can get it under control so the dentist can drill a hole in the tooth to fix it? I have. I'm doing it right now. We can't get the pain under control enough for the dentist to fix it. That's ONE tooth. ONE. Your chin's entire mouth is like that. Guess what? I go about my day, I teach my classes, I do my typing, I take care of my animals, and unlike your chin, I eat. Does that mean I'm not in excruciating pain? No, it does not. My mouth feels like someone has poured acid onto my tooth and lit it with a match. Every time I bend over, my head feels like it is going to explode. Every time I jar it, it feels like a lightning bolt to my gums. Looking at me, you would have absolutely no idea that I am in pain, but trust me, right about now cutting off my head seems like a viable option.

As an animal care taker, it is your job to make the tough decisions. I realize you love him. Every animal I've ever had to put to sleep I have loved. It hard. It's unfair. It sucks. You know what's worse? Keeping an animal alive who shouldn't be. Spend some time with him, love him, them let him go. You're his caretaker, it should be about his best interests, not your feelings. If that's too blunt for you, I'm sorry, but we've watched 100s of people come and go on this forum who insist their animal isn't in any pain because the owner couldn't stand to let them go. A good friend told me once better a minute to soon than a moment too late. I've lived it more times than you can possibly imagine and every time after I kick myself for not being the moment too soon.

 

[ticklechin]

I am one of those people Tunes has talked about, I treated malo and elongation, and when I say treated it was with experimental procedures performed with a team of vets-3 of them. I have done it all that was available at the time, apicoectomy, a surgical procedure that removes the roots. I have done selective tooth removal, UV light therapy, the chin sling-a custom made mask that the chin wore 8 hours a day to increase jaw strength, gingivectomy where the gum tissue is removed to get rid of periodontal disease, flap surgery to drain abscesses, acupuncture-chin not impressed, that and filings-literally I have done 100s on the 14 malo chins I dealt with. All that and over 15k and what did I end up with, 14 dead chins. Some put down, some died on their own. The stress of all those procedures is too much for the chins body, being in pain before and after procedures drags down the immune system and the succumb to usually URIs. I doped them up on opioids, so yeah the pain may or may not have been dimmed, they can't talk so you don't know, but pain killers take all the chin-ness out of the chin, so what are you left with.

I feel for you, I hated every single person on the forum (CNQ) who told me to put them down, I was called a lot of names, but you know what, my tail is now between my legs to those same people who were right, I have not had a malo chin is 5 years and will not hesitate to PTS if history repeats itself because I was keeping them alive for me and I did not want to accept failure, and I made those chins pay for my selfishness.

Here are a couple of pictures of my skulls of what your chin is going through, the first is what the xray looks like now, the second is what it will become.

 

[Kokorobosoi]

Thank you dawn. That was pretty much everything I held back before. I respect you so much for finding the strength to make the hard choice. Thank you for sharing your unique insight and for the pictures.

Hugs

Koko