grunting/snorting?

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I agree. This just is not typical chin behavior. That's not the way they play. Also the rearing and kacking is not a sign of togetherness, it's a sign of worse things to come.

well, considering how they zappa WAS kacking at him when he was being attacked, and now he is NOT... i tend to believe otherwise.

i might not be that experienced, but the two have been sitting in a shoebo together, cleaning each others ears and seem to be getting along just fine. i'll take some video tonight and post it.
 
Chins do not play wrestle... It doesn't sound like they're best friends to me at all.....

um, i'm pretty sure, being a pair of very young males, that they are play fighting. there is NO more barking or kacking, and they kiss each other and clean each others ears then bounce around the room and jump off the walls, etc. it is like they are a pair of puppies or my nieces and nephew wrestling around.

dominance is a normal instinct of any living creature, and watching kenny try to mount zappa, and vice versa.. i just really believe that they are fine together. again, videos tonight. :thumbsup:
 
Never have I ever seen or heard of chins "play wrestling" it's just not their nature, they're not puppies.

The standing on hind legs, "kissing", dominance humping and wrestling are all the things chins do when they are fighting not playing.

Chins can appear to be friends for one minute and kill each other the next. If it were me, I would not leave the chins together while I could not be there to supervise. That means separate cages and only together time while you can supervise until this aggressive behavior stops.

I'm not sure why you don't believe all of us who have had chins longer than you? We're not here to pick on you, we're here to protect your chins.

Some of us on here have had pairs together that have fought to the death. It's very sad and as a result we try to protect this from happening with other people's chins. Especially of those who don't know what aggression in chins looks like.
 
Zappa - No one is commenting on your lack of experience with chins as compared to the people who have had many years of experience who are commenting on your thread. We are simply telling you, from experience, chinchillas do not wrestle. Period. When kits wrestle? They rip each other's faces open, rip eyes out, and tear off ears.

When adults "wrestle" they jump on the other chins back and hold on until the other chin is down or mortally wounded. They skin them, like an Indian scalping in the wild west, from their eyebrows back. They puncture holes in their lungs. They tear strips of fur and skin off, exposing muscle and bone. The chin on the bottom doesn't stand a chance.

I wish I had taken pictures of a chin who is finally starting to heal now that just had this happen. He and his cagemates started chasing each other, much like you are describing, but I saw no fur fly, so I didn't panic. That night I went out to feed, 6 hours later, and he was a bloody mess. He was a white, so it showed up ever so much better. His ears are ripped to shreds, his back had stripes, like if you took all five of your fingernails on one hand, dug in, and ripped. His nose was ripped open, his cheek, the back of his head. I spent an entire weekend with him on my chest to keep him warm and out of shock, filling him up with antibiotics, pain meds, and all kinds of other fun stuff. I am actually amazed that he made it through. He wasn't the worst I've seen, but he was right up there. There were four little weanlings together, and one of them tore up the other three. The white was the worst of the bunch.

Chins do not wrestle when playing. If your chins are wrestling, just please be aware that this could turn bad really fast, and it almost always happens when you're not home and you can't step in to separate them.
 
i believe you guys, just didn't see any threatening signs besides zappa finally standing up for himself. they cleaned each other and kissed for quite some time. WELL! time to go see what they are up to. i'll let you know the winner :)
 
i believe you guys, just didn't see any threatening signs besides zappa finally standing up for himself. they cleaned each other and kissed for quite some time. WELL! time to go see what they are up to. i'll let you know the winner :)

You left them unsupervised together??

I really hope there is no "winner" because that would mean there is a loser. Losers in chin fights often die. :(

How long have you had Zappa and how old is he and your other chin?
 
trust me! i believe you guys! i just dont want to. i have never seen animals of the same species not play wrestle. the smaller male [8 months or so] was jumping on the larger male [8 -10 months] and they were rolling around like they were in their dust bath, but it was way way calmer than the previous fights they were in. and they would periodically stop and stare at each other and kiss, etc...

you're right. we did think everything was ok, and we DID leave them alone for about 4 hours here... NO problems!!

last night, they spent the night chasing each other, bouncing off of our faces as kenny normally would. so cute!


[my friend has had kenny for 2 months, and i got zappa last tuesday.]
 
here are some pics of them playing in the new fort. they love it! i just missed a great picture of both of them poking their heads out of holes right next to each other! :(

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Cute playhouse but please please unplug that electrical cord in the background so the chins don't chew it and electrocute themselves.
 
i have never seen animals of the same species not play wrestle.

Cows don't wrestle. Horses don't wrestle. Just to name a few species that do not play wrestle....

Zappa, I have had chins for years. All boys. They do NOT play wrestle. AT all. Excuse me for trying to help, but I know chinchillas and their behavior inside and out. Standing up on their hind legs and wrestling are aggression and nothing but. Feel fortunate that you have actual warning signs and can separate them before any damage is done.

I am one of those people that have had a chin (chins) KILL his cage mate. Introductions are not something that can be rushed and it sounds like you have enough aggression between those chins that they are not ready to be together. Yes they may stop and interact unaggressively, but that doesn't mean they are best friends.

My two chins cuddled together and loved each other. When I went to bed, they were squished together on a ledge happily sleeping. When I woke up, one was laying on the bottom of his cage in his own pool of blood, puncture wounds through his nose, skin ripped off his back, gasping through his mouth, the cage was covered in fur and blood. I had to drive him an hour and a half to the emergency vet and spent $400 for them to tell me there wasn't much they could do. He died several hours later laying on my chest.

I hope it doesn't happen and I hope you get lucky, but we'll be here should you wake up to find one chin in the same position as I found mine. Maybe then you'll understand, but I hope it doesn't take that to make you understand. I hope you listen to us and separate them BEFORE it happens. You are rushing things WAY too quickly and I would never even think of leaving chins together unsupervised after this sort of aggression had been displayed only hours before. It just boggles me.
 
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I've done a handful of intros with chins and "wrestling" is one of the major signs I recognize as a time to separate the chins and either start from the beginning (cages side by side, slower intros), or accept that they will be in separate cages.
You are tempting fate leaving those two together. They have demonstrated to you that they are not getting along. I would never keep chins who are wrestling or standing up on their hind legs together for any extended period of time - ESPECIALLY without my supervision.
Unfortunately with chins, sometimes they will NEVER get along. And even if they do, sometimes things happen in the future where you may have to separate (and those signs are the signs that they are exhibiting now!!). That's why we always caution owners to have an extra cage/accessories on hand in case it is ever needed.
 
Zappa - They look like they are having a blast with those boxes. It always amuses me to see chins having a great time with things that didn't cost hundreds of dollars that are just laying around the house. :)

As far as getting along goes, I will second whoever said to let them have supervised play time for now. That way you are there to watch if anything happens and can intervene and put them back in their separate cages. You can also try trimming their whiskers back by a good inch and a half or so. It really helps with aggression. I had a cage of little boys here that started with a little chasing. No fur flying, but some posturing (hind leg standing) and kacking. I nipped that in the bud, trimmed all their whiskers, and they are doing great now. They were just youngsters though, weanlings, and that is a much easier introduction that older chins.
 
ok ok!! i understand, you are all repeating yourselves.

i am sorry to offend anyone who thinks it was unwise, and it may be so. i would cry if i found our chinnies dead or hurt.. today there were some chunks of hair on the ground as a result of some fighting.



one question?? why dont they fight like this in pet stores? both of our chinchillas came from a pet store from a cage with other chinnies coming and going and they never fought. is it because they dont get territorial in a pet store, or??

thanks :)
 
I hope you separated them, then.

They probably get along with them because they have been with them for awhile, were kept together at the wholesaler, who knows. They may fight in the pet store and you just don't know it. They may be too scared and confused to fight. Who knows.

Chins react differently to different chins. A new chin in their territory could mean a fight, even if they get along with another chin currently.
 
I notice you mentioned that your chins "kiss" after the attempted dominance mountings. I don't know if this is they type of "kiss" they're doing but I've noticed in some of my intros that when chins are face-to-face, stand up on their hind legs, heads moving side-to-side as if to get around the other chin's head, noses almost touching, and whiskers pointing toward the other chin, it is an aggressive "sizing-up" of the other chin. It can look like kisses but I interpret it as a warning and wanting to be left alone. After this "kissing" the chins often go separate ways and avoid each other for a bit... but if they run into each other again, it often ends up in more mounting or fighting.

Young chins often get along fine. Most of the problems occur once they reach maturity - the hormones start affecting them, making them likely to be more aggressive and territorial.
 
It could be as Sumiko said, and the chins in the pet store are young, or it could be that they are terrified and too busy being scared to worry about territorial issues and fighting.
 
zappa--very cool cardboard play boxes..........very creative, they are awesome!
I can really see that you love your chins and I do hope that you can take the advice of everyone here. If you really want to see some evidence, you can easily use the search feature and see chins that have been injured in fights.

When Stacie posted her pix of her boys that she lost in a fight, i sat at my computer and cried. And because of her and others I decided to separate my two boys, they now live side by side but I could not trust them to be alone.

My only other concern and I believe someone mentioned it already is the outlet cord.
again, if you want to read some horror stories or see pictures, use the search feature and you can read about how chins bit a cord and got electrocuted and burned to death and died.

i am so glad you found this forum and can share you super cool pix of you babies and i really hope you can take the advice and not feel like anyone is criticizing.

we all love our chins and we love hearing good stories about eachothers chins and their silly antics. please dont let your chins be a part of the horror stories that we also have to endure.
if you would like pix of my cage setup, please feel free to pm me.
 
thanks, michelle. we have separated them, only letting one freely roam at a time, unless we are there to pay close attention to them. we will continue to build on the box fortress, too. i want to get a 4x4 post, and build some spiraling staircases and landing zones and attach old carpet to the post and steps [like a cat toy that goes for $200]. i think i could build some really fun stuff for them for relatively cheap, or free using scrap wood and carpet.


as for the cord... believe it or not, i was in the room about a month ago, and we saw a spark... a pretty big spark.. the cord was chewed so far through that when i touched it, it sparked again because so much wire was exposed.. Kenny had a brown spot of fur on his face, but was not burned, just his hair was singed a tiny bit and smelled. it was almost funny how cute he looked as he was so confused to what just happened.. we have since covered all the wires as best as we could, and supervise the chins as they explore the room. the wire biting has stopped for sure. the problem now is the molding along the bottom of the wall!
 
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